Green Gas And Propane?
Posted 19 September 2012 - 11:26 AM
Ive actually considered the same idea before, never go around to actually doing it though.
Posted 19 September 2012 - 04:31 PM
The economics of propane can't be ignored as it's only 5% of the cost of green gas and I'd think the 95% cost savings would more than pay for some internal repair parts. A 12-can case of green gas has 6 pounds of gas.
That said I'm using green gas exclusively.
Posted 19 September 2012 - 06:44 PM
Edited by darkbluedean, 19 October 2012 - 09:56 PM.
Posted 28 November 2012 - 11:36 PM
I also found more than one site that answers the question of whether propane is corrosive: the answer is yes, it is an excellent solvent for petro-chemical based materials (plastic) and rubber.
So, since both Green Gas and Propane seem to be corrosive to some of your guns internals, what is the answer? First, heed what KWA requires during the warranty period: no propane. Second, lubricate your gun with a non-solvent based lube. I've been using pure silicone oil (Check the labelling: some "Pure Silicone" lubes have solvents) or pure lithium grease to lube my gas guns for a few years now. I also give my mags a squirt of green gas occasionally just to inject a little silicone into them to keep the seals fresh, and then use propane the majority of the time. I have found that aside from GG being so expensive it just puts too much silicone into my mags if I use it all the time, eventually works its way into the hop up, the barrel, etc, and it's a mess. So I do the combo thing, and use the GG sparingly.
Also, lubing your gun with a lubricant that won't hurt the plastic or rubber parts protects those parts from the corrosive effect of Propane/Green Gas, just like gun oil protects real weapons from the corrosive gasses from gun powder. And clean your gun, don't use profane language, and help little old ladies across the street.
Posted 16 December 2012 - 04:29 PM
Posted 20 December 2012 - 08:50 AM
Posted 24 December 2012 - 09:49 PM
Propane is a combination of carbon and hydrogen ... C3, H8 ... 3 carbon molecules and 8 hydrogen molecules
Propane is a petroleum byproduct
The Ethanethiol added to propane is an alcohol and as someone posted earlier it can react with transition metals... Mercury, copper, and nickel
Ok, so I'm a little nerdy ... I work in a file that requires knowledge of chemistry but I'm no expert.
The concern here is NOT propane, it's the lubrication. Propane is stored as a liquid and temperature plays a roll in pressure and volume of gas and liquid at the time of storing ... Storing meaning when it's put in the can or a magazine. Propane manufactures operate within consistent parameters when producing and storing propane... We do not.
In any event, it's the ratio of propane to silicone lubrication that is of concern... Too much or not enough silicone
I'm no expert in producing propane or green gas but I suspect each can of green gas gets an exact amount of oil at a specific temperature. Then straight propane is added without Ethanethiol. This method insures the same ratio of lubricant and propane at any temperature. If you have 2 ounces of silicone at 70 degrees and 14 ounces of propane you still have the same amount at 90 degrees or 50 degrees ... Only the volume changes ...
I don't think we can accurately produce the propane to silicon ratio by mixing ourselves. I'm sure we can come close. It's the ratio of propane to gas that's important here and I believe the engineers at KWA figured on a precise amount of propane and silicone. You can run a gasoline engine designed to run premium on regular; however it won't run as good as it could with the right fuel.
Perhaps internal lubricants like a Teflon coating could be used to improve the lubrication of moving parts?
The bottom line here is we want consistency in our guns and self mixing fuel and lubricant is not consistent. Will our guns wear prematurely using propane? Yes and no. We are using propane ... Wear is dependent on lubrication. If you use less lubricant the gun will wear ... Use too much and other problems will occur... Use exactly what was intended when the gun was designed and I think you'll be ok.
Regarding the smelliest stuff ever and saving money ... Here is a link to an MSDS sheet from The Department of Labor ... http://www.sciencela...?msdsId=9923940
This is all you want to know about the smelly stuff they put in propane ... Ethyl Mercaptan ... While it may not kill you it can cause irritation, sore throat, nausea, stomach pain, headache, drowsiness, dizziness, loss of coordination; AND there is no data on long term effects of exposure.
Nevermind the warranty on the LM4, how much is your health worth?
I run green gas ... My 2 cents
Posted 24 December 2012 - 11:14 PM
Posted 25 December 2012 - 09:20 PM
Lol! Insanity ... Yes
Posted 26 December 2012 - 08:04 AM
Posted 26 December 2012 - 10:40 AM
FYI ... Talking with my buddy this morning who said "hell no I'm not paying for green gas" the moment he removed his LM4 from the box. He's experienced a multitude of problems... Feeding, jams... Asked me if I want to go in on a case of green gas
Posted 26 December 2012 - 11:02 PM
When I run propane I run it "dry" and only add silicone for storage.
Posted 07 January 2013 - 09:41 AM
Posted 10 January 2013 - 02:16 PM
Posted 10 January 2013 - 05:09 PM
Posted 10 January 2013 - 05:54 PM
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Posted 27 January 2013 - 09:27 AM
Posted 27 January 2013 - 10:42 PM
Posted 28 January 2013 - 03:41 PM
Posted 29 January 2013 - 01:16 PM
"burning the contents of this canister,whose primary component is propane..." that is on a LIGHTNING BOLT can of green gas. On the King Arms can it says "burning propane can make carbon monoxide.." thus implying that it is primarily propane with what ever else is in it.
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