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Systema Magnum verses stock KWA


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#1 Blacssr@bellsouth.net

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Posted 29 October 2008 - 05:26 PM

FYI:

I finally had time to test the Systema Magnum in my slightly upgraded M16. Spent over 4 hours today testing various setups. Average numbers posted.So without further adieu::::::>>>>>>>

Specs: Unchanged during testing. Lipo was recharged to full capacity between tests in an attempt to keep variables to a minimum.

KWA M16
Deans connectors
Stock gears, piston and cylinder
Zero Cylinder
11.1 Volt 2750mah LIPO w/ 30c discharge
Prometheus 590 mm PSG-1 TB w/Classic Army 4" Silencer
Extreme-fire AB Mosfet w/ added heat sinks
18,000 uf Capacitor bank.

Setup No.1

Stock Motor:
Stock 130 Spring- .25g- 425 fps- 24 bps

Systema Magnum:
Stock 130 Spring- .25g- 425 fps- 29 bps

Setup No.2

Stock Motor:
Guarder 140 Spring- .25g- 445 fps- 20 bps (Motor go very Hot- Straining to pull spring!)

Systema Magnum:
Guarder140 Spring- .25g- 450 fps- 27 bps (Motor is flawless- Easily pulls spring and runs cool)

Setup No.3

Stock Motor:
Guarder 150 Spring- .25g- 475 fps- 18 bps (Motor go very Hot- Straining to pull spring!)

Systema Magnum:
Guarder150 Spring- .25g- 480 fps- 27 bps (Motor is flawless- Easily pulls spring and runs slightly warm)

I am pleased overall with purchase, but a bit disappointed that I could not hit 500fps-30bps (Maybe next time). I will stay with Setup no.3 This is by far the best setup I have run. I play on a field with unlimited class- No kids-

Edited by Blacssr@bellsouth.net, 29 October 2008 - 05:47 PM.


#2 brooklyn468

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Posted 29 October 2008 - 05:28 PM

Thank you, this will help us a lot :)

#3 threadkill

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Posted 29 October 2008 - 06:47 PM

Excellent post; much needed data. Cheers!

ETA - I am running a Systema M150 spring; also have the AB-Long mosfet; thanks to your related post. I also just upgraded to the Magnum motor (wow!). Can you comment on the trigger response with the stock motor versus the Systema?

Edited by threadkill, 08 November 2008 - 08:43 AM.


#4 AirsoftFreak

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Posted 29 October 2008 - 09:46 PM

Just the info I needed.
Thanks

#5 vic_man4

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Posted 30 October 2008 - 04:09 PM

View PostBlacssr@bellsouth.net, on Oct 29 2008, 05:26 PM, said:

FYI:

I finally had time to test the Systema Magnum in my slightly upgraded M16. Spent over 4 hours today testing various setups. Average numbers posted.So without further adieu::::::>>>>>>>

Specs: Unchanged during testing. Lipo was recharged to full capacity between tests in an attempt to keep variables to a minimum.

KWA M16
Deans connectors
Stock gears, piston and cylinder
Zero Cylinder
11.1 Volt 2750mah LIPO w/ 30c discharge
Prometheus 590 mm PSG-1 TB w/Classic Army 4" Silencer
Extreme-fire AB Mosfet w/ added heat sinks
18,000 uf Capacitor bank.

Setup No.1

Stock Motor:
Stock 130 Spring- .25g- 425 fps- 24 bps

Systema Magnum:
Stock 130 Spring- .25g- 425 fps- 29 bps

Setup No.2

Stock Motor:
Guarder 140 Spring- .25g- 445 fps- 20 bps (Motor go very Hot- Straining to pull spring!)

Systema Magnum:
Guarder140 Spring- .25g- 450 fps- 27 bps (Motor is flawless- Easily pulls spring and runs cool)

Setup No.3

Stock Motor:
Guarder 150 Spring- .25g- 475 fps- 18 bps (Motor go very Hot- Straining to pull spring!)

Systema Magnum:
Guarder150 Spring- .25g- 480 fps- 27 bps (Motor is flawless- Easily pulls spring and runs slightly warm)

I am pleased overall with purchase, but a bit disappointed that I could not hit 500fps-30bps (Maybe next time). I will stay with Setup no.3 This is by far the best setup I have run. I play on a field with unlimited class- No kids-

Ehhhh heat sinks? Post up the pics of your mosfet I want to see the heat sinks :lol: sounds cool!

#6 Blacssr@bellsouth.net

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Posted 30 October 2008 - 04:19 PM

View Postvic_man4, on Oct 30 2008, 08:09 PM, said:

Ehhhh heat sinks? Post up the pics of your mosfet I want to see the heat sinks :lol: sounds cool!


http://www.newegg.co...N82E16835118220

#7 vic_man4

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Posted 31 October 2008 - 12:42 PM

View PostBlacssr@bellsouth.net, on Oct 30 2008, 05:19 PM, said:


Thats awesome, how did you get them onto your mosfet? Can you post up pics of your mosfet?

#8 Blacssr@bellsouth.net

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Posted 31 October 2008 - 04:52 PM

View Postvic_man4, on Oct 31 2008, 04:42 PM, said:

Thats awesome, how did you get them onto your mosfet? Can you post up pics of your mosfet?


They stick on with very thin heat transfer adhesive.
I "shrunk wrap" entire unit a photo would be useless. You would only see a black blob with wires exiting it.
The nest time I break gun I'll snap some photos when I have gun in 50 pieces !

Edited by Blacssr@bellsouth.net, 31 October 2008 - 04:53 PM.


#9 vic_man4

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Posted 01 November 2008 - 05:14 PM

View PostBlacssr@bellsouth.net, on Oct 31 2008, 04:52 PM, said:

They stick on with very thin heat transfer adhesive.
I "shrunk wrap" entire unit a photo would be useless. You would only see a black blob with wires exiting it.
The nest time I break gun I'll snap some photos when I have gun in 50 pieces !

Did it come with the adhesive? And how good do they work, like would you suggest them for people like me who are going to get a mosfet eventually.

#10 Blacssr@bellsouth.net

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Posted 03 November 2008 - 03:47 PM

View Postvic_man4, on Nov 1 2008, 08:14 PM, said:

Did it come with the adhesive? And how good do they work, like would you suggest them for people like me who are going to get a mosfet eventually.

Yes,
Awesome,
Yes.

#11 vic_man4

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Posted 03 November 2008 - 03:50 PM

View PostBlacssr@bellsouth.net, on Nov 3 2008, 03:47 PM, said:

Yes,
Awesome,
Yes.

Pretty straight forward, I read that the adheasive they come with sucks :/ Oh well, if I do get them I guess Ill have to manage :lol:

#12 Blacssr@bellsouth.net

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Posted 07 November 2008 - 04:57 PM

View Postthreadkill, on Oct 29 2008, 09:47 PM, said:

Excellent post; much needed data. Cheers!

ETA - I am running a Systema M140 spring; also have the AB-Long mosfet; thanks to your related post. Can you comment on the trigger response with the stock motor versus the Systema?


Pretty even at 130 spring level. However, at higher levels the Magnum has no equal.

#13 Blacssr@bellsouth.net

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Posted 07 November 2008 - 06:18 PM

View PostBlacssr@bellsouth.net, on Oct 29 2008, 08:26 PM, said:

FYI:

I finally had time to test the Systema Magnum in my slightly upgraded M16. Spent over 4 hours today testing various setups. Average numbers posted.So without further adieu::::::>>>>>>>

Specs: Unchanged during testing. Lipo was recharged to full capacity between tests in an attempt to keep variables to a minimum.

KWA M16
Deans connectors
Stock gears, piston and cylinder
Zero Cylinder
11.1 Volt 2750mah LIPO w/ 30c discharge
Prometheus 590 mm PSG-1 TB w/Classic Army 4" Silencer
Extreme-fire AB Mosfet w/ added heat sinks
18,000 uf Capacitor bank.

Setup No.1

Stock Motor:
Stock 130 Spring- .25g- 425 fps- 24 bps

Systema Magnum:
Stock 130 Spring- .25g- 425 fps- 29 bps

Setup No.2

Stock Motor:
Guarder 140 Spring- .25g- 445 fps- 20 bps (Motor go very Hot- Straining to pull spring!)

Systema Magnum:
Guarder140 Spring- .25g- 450 fps- 27 bps (Motor is flawless- Easily pulls spring and runs cool)

Setup No.3

Stock Motor:
Guarder 150 Spring- .25g- 475 fps- 18 bps (Motor go very Hot- Straining to pull spring!)

Systema Magnum:
Guarder150 Spring- .25g- 480 fps- 27 bps (Motor is flawless- Easily pulls spring and runs slightly warm)

I am pleased overall with purchase, but a bit disappointed that I could not hit 500fps-30bps (Maybe next time). I will stay with Setup no.3 This is by far the best setup I have run. I play on a field with unlimited class- No kids-


Update as of November 7, 2008:

I recently upgraded Lipo to 3300mah 40 amp continuous and cut Magnum Motor armature on my RC motor lathe. Cleaned and lubed ball bearings, installed new high performance silver brushes.

New Numbers are as follows:

Systema Magnum:
Guarder150 Spring- .25g- 495 fps- 34 bps. Awesome speed.

I ordered a 160 spring from HK last week. 525/32 should be obtainable.

Edited by Blacssr@bellsouth.net, 07 November 2008 - 07:57 PM.


#14 Guest_allizard_*

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Posted 07 November 2008 - 09:08 PM

Remind me not to play with you if I see you on the field.   -_-

#15 Blacssr@bellsouth.net

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Posted 08 November 2008 - 06:12 AM

View Postallizard, on Nov 8 2008, 12:08 AM, said:

Remind me not to play with you if I see you on the field.   -_-

I feel no love here :-(.

The data I am supplying is very useful. I looked everywhere for this info on the Web. I couldn't find it anywhere so I decided to compile it myself. It takes quite a bit of time, money and effect to compile accurate data. Why are you frowning upon this information? The field we play on allows only adults, not kids(thank God!) and we enjoy the technology of it all as much as shooting each other.

If you have a problem with free accurate information please close this thread and I'll keep information to myself. If not let others enjoy and learn from it.

Thanks,

Mike

Edited by Blacssr@bellsouth.net, 08 November 2008 - 06:13 AM.


#16 threadkill

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Posted 08 November 2008 - 07:40 AM

[soap box] Being proactive on this topic.......

I think/hope Allizard was borrowing from a response on another forum thread about an open FPS field in the Philippines; that group is also into high-power airsoft. I am hoping that the response was a bit tongue-in-cheek, and slightly out of reverence.

To the topic - I think it important to understand as a community why some desire to take this awesome sport to a next level. For many, the logical progression of airsoft milsim is fuller body armor, adequate protection, and faster guns; a better simulation of the battlefield where kills can occur at greater distances and there's added incentive to take cover. This is absolutely the direction I want to move in milsim: an adult, responsible, sensible, realistic, and sphincter-puckering experience.

As a newer airsofter that has not yet found a team, I am currently more experimenting with higher muzzle velocities because it is simply cool and fun, and I am learning tons about airsoft maintenance. My M4A1 is shooting at ~500fps with .25s and I get a huge grin on my face every time I double-tap into a target. I strive to see how fast and accurate I can make my M4. If I wear out/break parts faster, I'll replace them an give the ProShop some business. I grew up with BB, pellet, and 22s and now have a target rifle that's legal and something with which I can do some serious plinking in the back yard.

KWA created a platform that is perfect for upgrading to higher levels; levels that are already in place in other distribution areas (some non-LE versions come stock with a M150). To taboo this topic would seem counterproductive and create a dual standard. We are creating LE (minus ROF) training weapons for a fraction of what Systema charges, which is about the best marketing strategy KWA could have. I state this because another speed-related thread became locked.

Dude, feel the love; you are taking this awesome sport and pastime to the next level. You are pushing the battery technology and understanding to a higher level, and creating the ultimate litmus test for the KWA mechbox. This is valuable data for any company. The community is blessed to have your knowledge, background, and desire to push the envelope. Tweaking the Magnum for higher performance deserves a salute and I'm sure has some of the young engineer-to-bees surfing for more data.

If for some reason the KWA folks think this an inappropriate topic for these forums, there are others that are not product-brand specific and would appreciate this data. I just hope they realize the value. And rather than just poo-poo a topic and lock a thread, update the forum rules with specific topics that are not open to discussion; let us determine if we are expending our energy on the right forum for what we wish to share. Nothing sez I-don't-belong-here like having a thread locked.

Look forward to the M160 results, either here, or in PM.

[/soap box]

#17 Blacssr@bellsouth.net

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Posted 08 November 2008 - 07:51 AM

View Postthreadkill, on Nov 8 2008, 10:40 AM, said:

[soap box] Being proactive on this topic.......

I think/hope Allizard was borrowing from a response on another forum thread about an open FPS field in the Philippines; that group is also into high-power airsoft. I am hoping that the response was a bit tongue-in-cheek, and slightly out of reverence.

To the topic - I think it important to understand as a community why some desire to take this awesome sport to a next level. For many, the logical progression of airsoft milsim is fuller body armor, adequate protection, and faster guns; a better simulation of the battlefield where kills can occur at greater distances and there's added incentive to take cover. This is absolutely the direction I want to move in milsim: an adult, responsible, sensible, realistic, and sphincter-puckering experience.

As a newer airsofter that has not yet found a team, I am currently more experimenting with higher muzzle velocities because it is simply cool and fun, and I am learning tons about airsoft maintenance. My M4A1 is shooting at ~500fps with .25s and I get a huge grin on my face every time I double-tap into a target. I strive to see how fast and accurate I can make my M4. If I wear out/break parts faster, I'll replace them an give the ProShop some business. I grew up with BB, pellet, and 22s and now have a target rifle that's legal and something with which I can do some serious plinking in the back yard.

KWA created a platform that is perfect for upgrading to higher levels; levels that are already in place in other distribution areas (some non-LE versions come stock with a M150). To taboo this topic would seem counterproductive and create a dual standard. We are creating LE (minus ROF) training weapons for a fraction of what Systema charges, which is about the best marketing strategy KWA could have. I state this because another speed-related thread became locked.

Dude, feel the love; you are taking this awesome sport and pastime to the next level. You are pushing the battery technology and understanding to a higher level, and creating the ultimate litmus test for the KWA mechbox. This is valuable data for any company. The community is blessed to have your knowledge, background, and desire to push the envelope. Tweaking the Magnum for higher performance deserves a salute and I'm sure has some of the young engineer-to-bees surfing for more data.

If for some reason the KWA folks think this an inappropriate topic for these forums, there are others that are not product-brand specific and would appreciate this data. I just hope they realize the value. And rather than just poo-poo a topic and lock a thread, update the forum rules with specific topics that are not open to discussion; let us determine if we are expending our energy on the right forum for what we wish to share. Nothing sez I-don't-belong-here like having a thread locked.

Look forward to the M160 results, either here, or in PM.

[/soap box]

Spoken like a true poet! Thanks

#18 Stealthmaster14

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Posted 08 November 2008 - 09:35 AM

I think Allizard was only joking and meant that he is flipping scared of your gun. (500 fps at 30+ rps!!! COME ON!! THAT'S JUST MEAN!! ha ha)  I'm sure he is thankful for the info.  

I don't own a KWA, (still waiting on some models to come out ha ha) but this is a very interesting read.  I would love to see airsoft guns that can engage from 300+ feet and a high fps.  As long as people are responsible, it could definitely make it more exciting.  

thanks for the info!

Edited by Stealthmaster14, 08 November 2008 - 09:35 AM.


#19 triple b

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Posted 08 November 2008 - 11:56 AM

i love your comment but to be serious about milsim would to limit your self to 1000 rounds or less and 30 round magazines capacity limits...by the way more fps, (500) does not mean your bb travels farther than say a (400) its just means it get there faster....if your serious about the milsim thing look up some tournments in your area

Edited by triple b, 08 November 2008 - 12:03 PM.


#20 brooklyn468

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Posted 08 November 2008 - 09:02 PM

With the proper clothing, I think this would be a great idea!

The major problem is probably getting the right protection...




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