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KWA m4A1 with 509mm TB


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#1 ejec19glock

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Posted 20 October 2008 - 03:54 PM

Hey KWA community, I'm planning to put 509mm Prometheus TB on my m4. I want to keep her shooting at 400fps. What additional internal upgrades do I need. I heard about the systema type 0 cylinder. If you guys can also link the items I need so I can buy it right away. Got a big game 2 weeks from now. Thanks for inputs

#2 vic_man4

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Posted 20 October 2008 - 04:23 PM

View Postejec19glock, on Oct 20 2008, 04:54 PM, said:

Hey KWA community, I'm planning to put 509mm Prometheus TB on my m4. I want to keep her shooting at 400fps. What additional internal upgrades do I need. I heard about the systema type 0 cylinder. If you guys can also link the items I need so I can buy it right away. Got a big game 2 weeks from now. Thanks for inputs

You'll need to down grade the spring to probably a m100.
http://www.airsoftgi...roducts_id=1683

And heres the cylinder (Type 0)
http://www.airsoftgi...products_id=147

#3 ejec19glock

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Posted 20 October 2008 - 04:28 PM

Is there a reason for downgrading a spring on the upgrade I wanted to achieve?

#4 vic_man4

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Posted 20 October 2008 - 04:30 PM

View Postejec19glock, on Oct 20 2008, 05:28 PM, said:

Is there a reason for downgrading a spring on the upgrade I wanted to achieve?

The difference between the two cylinders (type 0 and the one you have now) is that the type 0 has no ports (holes) and the one you have now has ports allowing air to escape. When you upgrade the cylinder to a type 0 along with your barrel, no air will escape resulting in a much larger FPS, downgrading your spring is all you can do.

#5 ejec19glock

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Posted 20 October 2008 - 04:34 PM

Tnx, how about cylinder, piston head and pistons?

#6 vic_man4

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Posted 20 October 2008 - 04:38 PM

View Postejec19glock, on Oct 20 2008, 05:34 PM, said:

Tnx, how about cylinder, piston head and pistons?

I would suggest upgrading your spring guide to one with bearrings while your gearbox is open.

#7 ejec19glock

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Posted 20 October 2008 - 04:46 PM

will this work as a spring guide: http://www.airsoftpo...oducts_id=26296?

Summary:
509mm TB
Systema Type 0 Cylinder
Version 2 spring guide with bearings

Anything else? Tnx a bunch

#8 vic_man4

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Posted 20 October 2008 - 04:50 PM

View Postejec19glock, on Oct 20 2008, 05:46 PM, said:

will this work as a spring guide: http://www.airsoftpo...oducts_id=26296?

Summary:
509mm TB
Systema Type 0 Cylinder
Version 2 spring guide with bearings

Anything else? Tnx a bunch

Nope, theres nothing else that I can think of.

#9 Stealthmaster14

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Posted 20 October 2008 - 05:53 PM

I think he also meant to say that the spring guide will work :)

#10 ejec19glock

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Posted 20 October 2008 - 06:03 PM

Tnx, so you mean to that the type 0 cylinder with spring guide with bearings on 509mm TB will keep my gun on 400 fps range without changing anything else? If that's the case then that's awesome..

#11 Guest_allizard_*

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Posted 20 October 2008 - 06:16 PM

View Postejec19glock, on Oct 20 2008, 05:46 PM, said:

will this work as a spring guide: http://www.airsoftpo...oducts_id=26296?

Summary:
509mm TB
Systema Type 0 Cylinder
Version 2 spring guide with bearings

Anything else? Tnx a bunch

don't waste your money on the bearing spring guide.  Also KWA spring guide is a Type 3... you can't use type 2.

#12 ejec19glock

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Posted 20 October 2008 - 06:21 PM

Ok tnx I will keep the stock spring guide then. So the m4 with 509mm tb + type 0 cylinder will still achieve 400fps?

#13 Stealthmaster14

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Posted 20 October 2008 - 07:53 PM

View Postallizard, on Oct 20 2008, 07:16 PM, said:

don't waste your money on the bearing spring guide.  Also KWA spring guide is a Type 3... you can't use type 2.

OH YEAH!!  My bad ejec19glock, I forgot that the KWA M4s use V3 spring guides.

@Allizard, is there a benefit or reason for using a V3 spring guide?

#14 triple b

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Posted 20 October 2008 - 09:10 PM

what kind or how long of a silencer would you need to hide that type of barrel and keep it secure?

#15 Lt. Tony

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Posted 21 October 2008 - 05:35 AM

I'm a newbie at upgrading so please forgive me if this question is really stupid where exactly would this Systema Area 1000 Cylinder Type 0 go. Does it go in the gearbox?

#16 threadkill

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Posted 21 October 2008 - 08:42 AM

View PostLt. Tony, on Oct 21 2008, 09:35 AM, said:

I'm a newbie at upgrading so please forgive me if this question is really stupid where exactly would this Systema Area 1000 Cylinder Type 0 go. Does it go in the gearbox?

Not a stupid question if you've never been in a gearbox. Yes, the cylinder is inside the gearbox and houses the piston. It is the piston head, driven forward by the spring inside of the cylinder that creates the compression to propel a BB.

Search for and look at the MechBox vid on spring upgrades (now with many links within this forum); you'll see a gold colored tube the piston rides in. This is the cylinder. See above posts for differences between a "ported cylinder" (hole in the side) versus a solid, or non-ported cylinder (type 0). The length of the barrel determines the degree of porting on the cylinder, with the longer barrels being able to use a non-ported version. With my 407mm barrel, I chose a type 1 cylinder, where the port holes are right at the edge.

#17 threadkill

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Posted 21 October 2008 - 08:55 AM

View Postejec19glock, on Oct 20 2008, 10:21 PM, said:

Ok tnx I will keep the stock spring guide then. So the m4 with 509mm tb + type 0 cylinder will still achieve 400fps?

Based on the results of others here that were closer to 500 FPS with the same configuration and a M130 spring, it would seem that you will exceed 400 FPS. If your upcoming game limits FPS, your upgrade could take you out of the game if you don't have a backup gun.

The good news is that you could elect to try the longer barrel without touching your gearbox (always the safe plan) and see what that does for your accurracy and speed; get you through your game. With a game in less than two weeks, this might be all you can experiment with, given ship times, installation, tweaking your bucking for accuracy, and any sight adjustments. If you encounter any problems, you are then just dealing with swapping out the hop up chamber and bucking.

I am also relatively new and have now been my gearbox several, several times trying different things, and I can tell you that it is a non-trivial event at first, and there is always a risk of something/anything going wrong (loose or break a part). If I were an active Mil-Simmer (hope to find a team soon), I would not be so risky with my one gun.

Once you do determine the best silencer and mounting to hide the extra barrel length, do please post your findings; there are several that would like to try this.

#18 Guest_allizard_*

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Posted 21 October 2008 - 09:17 AM

View PostStealthmaster14, on Oct 20 2008, 08:53 PM, said:

OH YEAH!!  My bad ejec19glock, I forgot that the KWA M4s use V3 spring guides.

@Allizard, is there a benefit or reason for using a V3 spring guide?

Type 3 spring guide have a longer tab that locks into the gearbox shell so it will not pop out when servicing the gearbox.  It's also stronger than Type 2.

#19 Guest_allizard_*

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Posted 21 October 2008 - 09:19 AM

View Posttriple b, on Oct 20 2008, 10:10 PM, said:

what kind or how long of a silencer would you need to hide that type of barrel and keep it secure?

Most "so call silencer" only can be use to cover up the the inner barrel.  Its does not  have anything to SECURE the inner barrel from vibration.

#20 ejec19glock

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Posted 21 October 2008 - 10:02 AM

ok tnx for all your help, I decided to get this bore up kit from guarder http://www.airsoftpo...oducts_id=28018 any info on this and will this work or this

http://www.airsoftpo...oducts_id=28019

+ the 509mm tb im going to put. Tnx.

The first 1 was for m16A1 and the other one was for m16a2 any difference on the two?

Edited by ejec19glock, 21 October 2008 - 10:07 AM.





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