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Wanna Upgrade my G36

Parts Upgrade Barrel G36c Gears Springs Rof Fps

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#41 philsaudio

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Posted 16 July 2012 - 10:17 AM

View Postniko_gpsy, on 16 July 2012 - 08:18 AM, said:

I am confused.......even a 1st gen GB cylinder head would have some sort of sorbo padding.

This is what I got. I am no expert on identifying the parts but I think the 8mm+9mm bearings gives it away.
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The round thing is not sorbothane. It is hard like rubber. I pulled it off and put it on top of a 3/16 piece of sorbo.

#42 niko_gpsy

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Posted 20 July 2012 - 09:24 AM

Here are some pics that show AOE from a V2 GB (same position with the KWA V3) and also shows the 2nd tooth not needing to be removed in a KWA GB.

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#43 philsaudio

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Posted 21 July 2012 - 06:03 AM

View Postniko_gpsy, on 20 July 2012 - 09:24 AM, said:

Here are some pics that show AOE from a V2 GB (same position with the KWA V3) and also shows the 2nd tooth not needing to be removed in a KWA GB.

Posted Image









This picture kinda the right one, the following ones are of no help at all.  

Correction of AOE is evident when watching the first sector tooth come up before it reaches the pickup tooth. If AOE needs correction this sector tooth interferes with the second piston tooth. Your pictures begin with the sector already past the second tooth and into the pickup. I cant really see the piston in your picture. I cant see from your picture that there was no interference before the PU tooth was engaged.

To make me a believer I would need to see the right picture, one with the first sector tooth not hitting the second piston tooth as it comes up. But not only the K  with the KWA piston but also with another non KWA piston in the same position in that gearbox.

If KWA piston is TM compatible then the the pictures of both pistons would be the same. Wasn't it you that just posted that SS polycarb piston. I would like to see one like that (sans the tooth grinding)  in this GB with that CH, and also a picture of the CH with the sorbo. I know this is asking a lot of you but it will keep me from posting more disbelief of the KWA and TM compatibility both here and on the other airsoft forums.

Then again to really convince me, I would need another set of the same pictures with the KWA and another piston in a NON KWA GB.


What you just showed me actually puts even more doubt in my mind and , gives me more information to support the hypothisis that the KWA gearbox design about the piston to sector interface is not TM compatible.

Thanks for going the extra mile and you also gave me some ideas of what to do with that spare GB I just came across. I appreciate that and also appreciate arguing with a sharp mind, they are a rare find these days.  I have been observing AOE with only one side of the GB and I am always a little leery about the sector not being at 90 degrees with the shell. This mod to the GB would fix that.

Peace.

Edited by philsaudio, 21 July 2012 - 06:13 AM.


#44 niko_gpsy

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Posted 21 July 2012 - 08:12 AM

The first picture show the engagement tooth of the sector engaging the first tooth of the piston.  You are looking for the "90*" angle which is confusing you I think.  In every gearbox when adjusting the AOE you just have to make sure that the flat side of the 1st gear tooth hit the 1st tooth of the piston FLAT while at the same time clearing the 2nd tooth.  Some choose to remove the 2nd tooth just to simplify things when adjusting AOE. So some GB setup will appear to have the 90* (12 o'clock position) while others are not (around 1 o'clock position) and these are all TM compatible. I just don't know how to explain it any better. Sorry.......................

I think it would be more helpful is we can see this in action in slow motion but I don't have the ability to do so.

#45 philsaudio

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Posted 21 July 2012 - 09:01 AM

I do understand lining up the gear faces. I can not see that in the picture, it is not clear. The way KWA reinforces the piston obscures the gear face which is not a problem with other pistons.

Removal of the second tooth is not to make what I think you describe as "the process of going about adjusting the AOE  while the gearbox is appart".  You are the first person I have encountered who has made such a claim. I dismiss it. The second tooth is removed to prevent the first sector tooth from hitting those teeth other than the pickup while the gun is together and shooting bbs. End of argument.

I still contend and am not swayed with your questionabal statements above that if the KWA GB or Piston or combination does not fit the same as other TM compatible parts, and therefore the KWA GB, piston or both are NOT TM COMPATIBLE.

KWA needs a fact based response to this issue to convince me. I would have been happy that you just took some bad pictures but now with your description it just makes me dig in my heels more firmly.

Don't forget I have a KWA gun in front of me and this is not matching up with what I see with my own eyes.

Peace

#46 niko_gpsy

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Posted 21 July 2012 - 09:06 AM

The second tooth is removed sometimes because you can have perfect AOE in some cases but the 2nd tooth can get in the way of the sector engagement tooth.  So it IS removed in the process of adjusting AOE in some cases.
After all of this you still disagree with me so I will just leave it as WE AGREE TO DISAGREE.  You adjust your AOE as you see fit and just update us on how it holds up.

#47 philsaudio

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Posted 21 July 2012 - 09:10 AM

View Postniko_gpsy, on 21 July 2012 - 08:12 AM, said:

<snip> So some GB setup will appear to have the 90* (12 o'clock position) while others are not (around 1 o'clock position) and these are all TM compatible. I just don't know how to explain it any better. Sorry.......................
<snip>


When something is to spec it seems to me that would mean, it is one way or the other not both. This is my problem all along. Especially when one way works for me and the other does not. I veer toward the logical conclusions unless I have some facts to sway me.

Peace

#48 niko_gpsy

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Posted 21 July 2012 - 09:18 AM

Logical or not, if you have worked with as many aftermarket parts as I have you will see that it's just the way it is.  And they all claim TM compatible but they are not all to exact spec and KWA is not off spec any more than any other aftermarket parts out there.

#49 philsaudio

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Posted 21 July 2012 - 09:18 AM

View Postniko_gpsy, on 21 July 2012 - 09:06 AM, said:

The second tooth is removed sometimes because you can have perfect AOE in some cases but the 2nd tooth can get in the way of the sector engagement tooth.  So it IS removed in the process of adjusting AOE in some cases.
After all of this you still disagree with me so I will just leave it as WE AGREE TO DISAGREE.  You adjust your AOE as you see fit and just update us on how it holds up.

I still want to see that sorbo on the CH if you dont mind.

I can't just agree to disagree. Especially with a pro KWA guy on the KWA site. There is too much bias toward KWA propaganda on this board. Want to take it to another neutral board maybe , but not here for sure.

I will continue point out my position every chance I get until I am convinced it is wrong. Once you convince me I will stay convinced, if you don't I will continue to post arguments with my point of view. I remain open to your convincing me but I am not going to roll cause you said so.

#50 philsaudio

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Posted 21 July 2012 - 09:22 AM

View Postniko_gpsy, on 21 July 2012 - 09:18 AM, said:

Logical or not, if you have worked with as many aftermarket parts as I have you will see that it's just the way it is.  And they all claim TM compatible but they are not all to exact spec and KWA is not off spec any more than any other aftermarket parts out there.

And for the record I am a newb. But one who has been a professional engineer for 30 years so not an idiot NOOB. I do and can respect all of your experience however, I am just not ready to roll on your word because I do not even know who you are. On this board you wear the KWA Marketing Team mask.

Peace

#51 niko_gpsy

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Posted 21 July 2012 - 11:25 AM

Phil
Don't misunderstand me.  I am not implying that you are some kind of "idiot noob" and I hope I didn't come off that way. I treat everyone with the same respect and courtesy no matter what their background may be.
I think when you start working on other brands you will at least see my point of view even if you may not agree with me.  I have not always been a part of KWA and I have worked on many, to say the least, different brands of guns before KWA.  And one eye opening conclusion that I have come to is that no matter how "TM spec" these different companies are supposed claim to be, they are all different to a degree so adjustments have to be made when using parts from different manufacturers for them to work properly.  So to say that KWA is completely proprietary and out of spec compared to these different companies is not true.
And I could have guessed that you were an engineer of some sort from reading your discussion on lipo batteries. :P
(I hope an electrical engineer......................................I need help with a MOSFET design.) lol





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