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Why is the rate of fire slow on my kwa sr5?

kwa sr5 rate of fire 11.1 lipo deans

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#1 iwamofo

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Posted 17 February 2014 - 02:32 PM

I was testing out the ROF on my stock sr5 i just recieved with a 11.1V 1500mah 20C battery and was topping out at 16rps.  The gun and battery is wired to deans and people without deans are getting around 20rps, so I am a little confused.  Could it be my battery? The battery is also brand new but it is from a lesser known company called lion power.  I don't have other batteries to test out now so I can't compare it with others.

#2 niko_gpsy

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Posted 17 February 2014 - 03:34 PM

Are you fully charging your battery?  Sounds like the battery is not fully charged.  You should invest in a smart charger with a voltage readout.

#3 tales

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Posted 17 February 2014 - 03:35 PM

The charger should show the volts of the battery, Can you post the volts? Did you balance the cells when charging?  Excluding the trigger contact there are two more poor connectors in the system, besides the battery that you changed.

If all is good you might have to upgrade the motor. 16 RPS with a stock KWA motor along with a 3S lipo does seem low.

Is the gun new?

#4 Chuck S

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Posted 17 February 2014 - 03:36 PM

Assuming you don't have a gearbox that's binding the cyclic rate is dependent on motor rpm which is dependent on battery voltage.

Did you charge the battery or just pop it in the gun?  Charging with a LiPO charger?

My stock KM4-CQB cycles at 1500 rpm (25rps) with an 11.1v LiPO, 960rpm (16rps) with an 8.4v NiMH battery and 680rpm (11.5rps) with a 7.4v LiPO.  Not linear but higher voltage yields higher cycling.

-- Chuck

#5 iwamofo

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Posted 17 February 2014 - 04:37 PM

View Postniko_gpsy, on 17 February 2014 - 03:34 PM, said:

Are you fully charging your battery?  Sounds like the battery is not fully charged.  You should invest in a smart charger with a voltage readout.

Yes the battery was fully charged on a tenergy balance charger that does not have a voltage readout.

#6 iwamofo

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Posted 17 February 2014 - 04:42 PM

View Posttales, on 17 February 2014 - 03:35 PM, said:

The charger should show the volts of the battery, Can you post the volts? Did you balance the cells when charging?  Excluding the trigger contact there are two more poor connectors in the system, besides the battery that you changed.

If all is good you might have to upgrade the motor. 16 RPS with a stock KWA motor along with a 3S lipo does seem low.  

Is the gun new?

The gun is brand new so I am pretty sure the motor is not the problem.  I can test it later with my other kwa motor if I need to.  Also, I took out the other connections and have wired those to deans too.  I charged the battery on a tenergy balance charger which does not give any readings.  My guess is the battery is of poor quality.  I have ordered a Gens Ace lipo to test out.

#7 iwamofo

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Posted 17 February 2014 - 04:43 PM

View PostChuck S, on 17 February 2014 - 03:36 PM, said:

Assuming you don't have a gearbox that's binding the cyclic rate is dependent on motor rpm which is dependent on battery voltage.

Did you charge the battery or just pop it in the gun?  Charging with a LiPO charger?

My stock KM4-CQB cycles at 1500 rpm (25rps) with an 11.1v LiPO, 960rpm (16rps) with an 8.4v NiMH battery and 680rpm (11.5rps) with a 7.4v LiPO.  Not linear but higher voltage yields higher cycling.

-- Chuck

Yes the battery was fully charged on a tenergy balance charger.

#8 tales

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Posted 17 February 2014 - 05:10 PM

View Postiwamofo, on 17 February 2014 - 04:42 PM, said:

The gun is brand new so I am pretty sure the motor is not the problem.  I can test it later with my other kwa motor if I need to.  Also, I took out the other connections and have wired those to deans too.  I charged the battery on a tenergy balance charger which does not give any readings.  My guess is the battery is of poor quality.  I have ordered a Gens Ace lipo to test out.

So you changed the connectors in the buffer tube? These are the same connectors that connect to the motor. Check them.
It takes time to break-in a motor brush. I seat them at low voltage to "shape" them to the commutator. 11.1V can crack a new brush
Ive seen this happen many times. Try the other motor.

Can you post a link to the charger?

#9 iwamofo

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Posted 17 February 2014 - 05:12 PM

View Posttales, on 17 February 2014 - 05:10 PM, said:

So you changed the connectors in the buffer tube? These are the same connectors that connect to the motor. Check them.
It takes time to break-in a motor brush. I seat them at low voltage to "shape" them to the commutator. 11.1V can crack a new brush
Ive seen this happen many times. Try the other motor.

Can you post a link to the charger?
Yes I have changed the connectors in the buffer tube to deans with the help of 16awg wiring.  

charger:http://www.amazon.com/Tenergy-Balance-Airsoft-Battery-Charger/dp/B004FGWY54

#10 iwamofo

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Posted 17 February 2014 - 05:39 PM

View Posttales, on 17 February 2014 - 05:10 PM, said:

So you changed the connectors in the buffer tube? These are the same connectors that connect to the motor. Check them.
It takes time to break-in a motor brush. I seat them at low voltage to "shape" them to the commutator. 11.1V can crack a new brush
Ive seen this happen many times. Try the other motor.

Can you post a link to the charger?

Ok, so I test the gun with my other kwa motor and got the same readings.

On a side note, is it normal for kwa motors to differ in height.  My sr10 motor was a good half cm taller than the sr5.  And yes I adjusted the motor height when testing.

#11 tales

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Posted 17 February 2014 - 05:41 PM

Not the best choice for a charger. there isn't a display. Where in NY are you?

#12 gcw360

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Posted 17 February 2014 - 05:47 PM

View Postiwamofo, on 17 February 2014 - 05:39 PM, said:

Ok, so I test the gun with my other kwa motor and got the same readings.

On a side note, is it normal for kwa motors to differ in height.  My sr10 motor was a good half cm taller than the sr5.  And yes I adjusted the motor height when testing.
Sure would like to see both motors side-by-side...

#13 iwamofo

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Posted 17 February 2014 - 05:50 PM

View Postgcw360, on 17 February 2014 - 05:47 PM, said:

Sure would like to see both motors side-by-side...
You'll have to take my word for it.  I don't see what taking a picture of it and uploading it here will do for you.

#14 iwamofo

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Posted 17 February 2014 - 05:51 PM

View Posttales, on 17 February 2014 - 05:41 PM, said:

Not the best choice for a charger. there isn't a display. Where in NY are you?
In dutchess county

#15 tales

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Posted 17 February 2014 - 06:17 PM

View Postiwamofo, on 17 February 2014 - 05:50 PM, said:

You'll have to take my word for it.  I don't see what taking a picture of it and uploading it here will do for you.

I don't think that gun is sold by KWA in the states, Maybe he want to see if there the same, Im sure he had a good reason for asking.
Is it from airsplat (SC)?

Im in Bklyn, i have a charger & battery you could try. You're welcome to try them. Anything else you could try? Maybe a different battery & another KWA gun? to compare the numbers?

#16 iwamofo

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Posted 17 February 2014 - 06:26 PM

Yea I just don't want to go through the hassle you know.  Didn't mean to sound like a jackass.  Yes the gun is not sold in the states, I bought it from ehobbyasia and it has the U.S. Marines logo.  That is the only thing that differentiates it from the one sold in the states.  I'm coming to the conclusion that the battery is just poor quality and shooting at the rate of a 9.6 nihm.  I bought another battery that I will test it with when it arrives.

#17 gcw360

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Posted 17 February 2014 - 06:26 PM

View Postiwamofo, on 17 February 2014 - 05:50 PM, said:

You'll have to take my word for it.  I don't see what taking a picture of it and uploading it here will do for you.
It would confirm that there are more that one standard long type motor being used in KWA AEG's.  While I have seen variations the the motor regarding the shell, labeling, and brush springs, I have never seen two of different lengths and I have been associated with KWA for a very long time as both a moderator and Forum Admin.  Changes like you described do occur and when they happen it's important to have that information in order to properly advise members like yourself with regard to technical issues.  That is why I asked for the pictures.  That and because, until recently, the SR5 had been discontinued and now is available through the overseas market.  If you don't want to go through the "hassle", as you say, that's fine.  I do think it would help members on this Forum however which was my motivation.

#18 Larry

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Posted 17 February 2014 - 06:27 PM

You are doing a lot of work today, nothing making sense. Still working with the same battery?  Why dont you visit an airsoft store nearbye, let them put one of their 11.1 test batteries in there. What rate of fire were you getting with the battery you were using prior to this, and what kind of battery was that.

#19 tales

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Posted 17 February 2014 - 06:53 PM

Told ya he had a good reason for asking :)  Like Larry said take it to a shop, You keep going back to the batteries poor quality wait for the new one, hopefully thats the problem.

Suggestion, a charger with a readout to monitor the battery is helpful. I keep a DC charger that uses an AC adapter in the car.
Some have the AC adapters built in. Airsoft is illegal in NYC, so i use eBay a lot.
http://www.ebay.com/...cat=0&_from=R40

Edited by tales, 17 February 2014 - 06:53 PM.


#20 iwamofo

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Posted 17 February 2014 - 06:57 PM

View Postgcw360, on 17 February 2014 - 06:26 PM, said:

It would confirm that there are more that one standard long type motor being used in KWA AEG's.  While I have seen variations the the motor regarding the shell, labeling, and brush springs, I have never seen two of different lengths and I have been associated with KWA for a very long time as both a moderator and Forum Admin.  Changes like you described do occur and when they happen it's important to have that information in order to properly advise members like yourself with regard to technical issues.  That is why I asked for the pictures.  That and because, until recently, the SR5 had been discontinued and now is available through the overseas market.  If you don't want to go through the "hassle", as you say, that's fine.  I do think it would help members on this Forum however which was my motivation.

After remeasuring the heights of the two motors, I was incorrect by saying there was a half a cm difference.  It is around 1mm but there is a difference which is evident because of the fact the sr10 motor had to be adjusted to get the correct height in the sr5.  The sr10 motor would give the screechy high pitch sound so it was pretty obvious it had to be adjusted.  I would take a picture of it but it is difficult to see on camera.  I'm pretty sure they are the same type motor. The shell, labeling, and brush springs are the same.  It's just that one is a little taller than the other.

Edited by iwamofo, 17 February 2014 - 07:11 PM.






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