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Reliability of LM4

LM4 Reliability

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#1 SnowboardeR1298

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Posted 22 April 2013 - 02:27 PM

If any experienced LM4 user could post on this thread to let me/us know how reliable and durable the LM4 is after thousands of rounds, it would be greatly appreciated. Also, is this gun good enough stock to compete with AEGs or is it going to be essential to upgrade certain parts? Thanks in advance for your replies!

#2 BENboBEN

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Posted 22 April 2013 - 03:00 PM

I consider there to be 2 different kinds of reliability; performance reliability and physical reliability. Performance wise, this thing is great. It has very consistant fps, accuracy, and gas efficiency out of the box. If you can deal with heavy, 40rd mags, then it can definately compete with AEGs. The physical reliability has been a little off however. Keep this in mind though, I have one of the first runs. Several of the hop-up adjustment teeth have simply fallen off. I also had bbs get smashed and jammed, however, we all attributed that to overloading the magazines with bbs. Finally, the valve knocker broke one of its mounting rings. But it still works fine with only one. In the end, I definitely recommend the LM4 it is a great, reliable gun.

#3 SnowboardeR1298

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Posted 22 April 2013 - 03:10 PM

View PostBENboBEN, on 22 April 2013 - 03:00 PM, said:

I consider there to be 2 different kinds of reliability; performance reliability and physical reliability. Performance wise, this thing is great. It has very consistant fps, accuracy, and gas efficiency out of the box. If you can deal with heavy, 40rd mags, then it can definately compete with AEGs. The physical reliability has been a little off however. Keep this in mind though, I have one of the first runs. Several of the hop-up adjustment teeth have simply fallen off. I also had bbs get smashed and jammed, however, we all attributed that to overloading the magazines with bbs. Finally, the valve knocker broke one of its mounting rings. But it still works fine with only one. In the end, I definitely recommend the LM4 it is a great, reliable gun.

Awesome. However, how could you improve the physical reliability? (generally) And when you say you have one of the first runs, are you meaning that you have one of the first models released? And if that's correct, then are you implying KWA has released newer, improved models since it's release last year?

#4 muffinman1604

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Posted 22 April 2013 - 04:16 PM

I recommend the LM4 to anyone on the fence about one. It is a great gun.
My LM4 Magpul Edition is stock and has had 10K rounds through it and has had no issues. I just clean and take very good care of my gun. In my opinion these guns are very reliable. The mags might leak but it is very easy to fix them. The Gas efficiency is very good on the LM4 too. My LM4 shoots just as far as my SR12 did when it was stock, maybe even farther. The realism the GBBR adds is also a plus.

#5 -wigs-

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Posted 22 April 2013 - 05:14 PM

After over 17k rounds I figure I could chime in.
Out of the box the gun will easily be on par with most high end aegs. Keep in mind it's a gbbr so your rof isn't going to be 90rnds a second but you make up in this with excellent trigger response.
The overall preformance with mine has been amazing with few very minor problems which I will bring up later.
Externally the finish leaves a little to be desired on both the mags and recievers. All of my mags look like they have seen deployment and back from regular use and though my gun is painted third starting to rub away to bare metal.

Internally, the only problem I've had was with the stock hopup arm and one user mistake.
The stock arm is a win or lose. some folks get perfect results and never have to touch it, others (like me) have problems of bbs rolling out and the arm losing its tension. All easily fixed by slightly bending the arm or getting a new one. My one user problem was cranking on a flash hider that pushed my inner through the bucking.

That's it, two problems it over 17k rounds and playing every Saturday.
The range is impressive once you have it all dialed in, gas consumption is realy good for a gbbr, and the overall realism just trumps playing with an aeg.
Maintnance is a breeze and if you keep it clean and lightly lubed your going to have a very reliable gun.


#6 SnowboardeR1298

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Posted 22 April 2013 - 05:25 PM

Thanks for the reply man. That's good news. I really have been on the fence about it. I love the realism added to airsoft because of it but its quite a bit more expensive than a normal AEG. Would it be more effective in outdoors or CQB?

#7 BENboBEN

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Posted 22 April 2013 - 05:44 PM

View PostSnowboardeR1298, on 22 April 2013 - 03:10 PM, said:

Awesome. However, how could you improve the physical reliability? (generally) And when you say you have one of the first runs, are you meaning that you have one of the first models released? And if that's correct, then are you implying KWA has released newer, improved models since it's release last year?
I can't say with confidence that they fixed the quality problems as I only have my old LM4. I also think I have the only one in Michigan so I don't have much to compare it to. But based on what other people are saying, its fixed itself. Another thing to throw in is that the bolt catch will wear down, actually the bolt will.However, there are tutorials on how to prolong its life and fixing it afterwards is as simple as filing. All my other problems have been DIY fixed. I also have a lot of DIY mods. Thats another reason to pick it up, its very easy to mod and you can do some awesome things.

#8 SnowboardeR1298

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Posted 22 April 2013 - 05:46 PM

View Post-wigs-, on 22 April 2013 - 05:14 PM, said:

After over 17k rounds I figure I could chime in.
Out of the box the gun will easily be on par with most high end aegs. Keep in mind it's a gbbr so your rof isn't going to be 90rnds a second but you make up in this with excellent trigger response.
The overall preformance with mine has been amazing with few very minor problems which I will bring up later.
Externally the finish leaves a little to be desired on both the mags and recievers. All of my mags look like they have seen deployment and back from regular use and though my gun is painted third starting to rub away to bare metal.

Internally, the only problem I've had was with the stock hopup arm and one user mistake.
The stock arm is a win or lose. some folks get perfect results and never have to touch it, others (like me) have problems of bbs rolling out and the arm losing its tension. All easily fixed by slightly bending the arm or getting a new one. My one user problem was cranking on a flash hider that pushed my inner through the bucking.

That's it, two problems it over 17k rounds and playing every Saturday.
The range is impressive once you have it all dialed in, gas consumption is realy good for a gbbr, and the overall realism just trumps playing with an aeg.
Maintnance is a breeze and if you keep it clean and lightly lubed your going to have a very reliable gun.

Good news man. I really appreciate the reply. You're just the type of owner that I wanted to hear from. You've officially sold me on buying one for myself! Now I just gotta make myself spend the money. lol

One question though; what upgrades would you recommend both internally and externally?

#9 muffinman1604

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Posted 22 April 2013 - 05:47 PM

View PostSnowboardeR1298, on 22 April 2013 - 05:25 PM, said:

Thanks for the reply man. That's good news. I really have been on the fence about it. I love the realism added to airsoft because of it but its quite a bit more expensive than a normal AEG. Would it be more effective in outdoors or CQB?

The LM4 will work great in a CQB or field environment, just keep in mind gas guns function better when it is warm

#10 SnowboardeR1298

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Posted 22 April 2013 - 05:49 PM

View PostBENboBEN, on 22 April 2013 - 05:44 PM, said:

I can't say with confidence that they fixed the quality problems as I only have my old LM4. I also think I have the only one in Michigan so I don't have much to compare it to. But based on what other people are saying, its fixed itself. Another thing to throw in is that the bolt catch will wear down, actually the bolt will.However, there are tutorials on how to prolong its life and fixing it afterwards is as simple as filing. All my other problems have been DIY fixed. I also have a lot of DIY mods. Thats another reason to pick it up, its very easy to mod and you can do some awesome things.

Oh okay. Would you mind to expand on the BCG/bolt catch problem that I could possibly encounter? Eg. fixes, causes, etc.

#11 kullwarrior

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Posted 22 April 2013 - 06:43 PM

View PostBENboBEN, on 22 April 2013 - 05:44 PM, said:

I can't say with confidence that they fixed the quality problems as I only have my old LM4. I also think I have the only one in Michigan so I don't have much to compare it to. But based on what other people are saying, its fixed itself. Another thing to throw in is that the bolt catch will wear down, actually the bolt will.However, there are tutorials on how to prolong its life and fixing it afterwards is as simple as filing. All my other problems have been DIY fixed. I also have a lot of DIY mods. Thats another reason to pick it up, its very easy to mod and you can do some awesome things.
I found this is attribute to the bolt catch mod. One I reverted the loud back to stock dorm the bolt stop rounding off

//sorry for odd autocorrect words by my phone//



#12 BENboBEN

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Posted 22 April 2013 - 10:57 PM

View PostSnowboardeR1298, on 22 April 2013 - 05:49 PM, said:

Oh okay. Would you mind to expand on the BCG/bolt catch problem that I could possibly encounter? Eg. fixes, causes, etc.
The bolt rounds off over time, causing it not to stay locked back. The catch hasn't been wearing down though. To fix it, we have just been filing or grinding the bolt down to a flat edge.

There are a million topics already on the bolt catch mods, but basically we have been grinding and modding the bolt catch is a way that it can travel further up, creating more bolt contact, preventing a lot of wear.

#13 -wigs-

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Posted 23 April 2013 - 04:07 PM

Upgrade wise.
Externally that's entirely user preference
Internally I would change the stock bucking to the guarder and match that with the RAT tightbore, and do the bolt catch mod. Personally the only other two things I've done/ would recommend if you have the time and funds. First being polish the feed ramp and inside the upper where the bolt moves, change the stock hopup arm to the evo one, and possibly change out the stock mag catch for the steel guarder one but that's just again personal mods. With a better bucking and a tbb you should be golden.

#14 Chuck S

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 02:53 AM

So far I'd consider my box stock LM4-PTR to be a reliable gun.  I don't count rounds but she's been thru a couple of bottles of 0.32gr Elite Force BBs at least.  As a gas gun it's not going to perform well in cold temperatures as gas efficiency drops dramatically with temperature.  As a CQB carbine it's way too hot and is unlikely to be allowed in controlled game areas.

As a realistic trainer it's hard to top.  Limited magazine capacity is a realism plus, but it ain't gonna compete with an AEG with 300 rounds in a wind up magazine!  We can all dump a 120 round magazine in one burst with our AEGs; there would be at least 2, maybe 3 magazine changes required with the LM4.  Auto firing of a gas gun also cools them dramatically as well but the LM4 is not drastically affected by this and keeps running.

If your use requires hosing out thousands of BBs with crazy high cyclic rates the LM4 will be a difficult choice.  If your use calls for a more realistic round count and rate of fire (Milsim) the LM4 is very satisfying.  If your use is to simulate the same weapon you use in your police or military job (or fantasy) it does very well.

The bolt rounding issue is caused by depressing the bolt stop to release the bolt when locked back.  Cycling the charging handle avoids this wear and is recommended by many as it allows for full bolt carrier travel.  The "bolt lock modification" is designed to allow pulling back on the charging handle to release the bolt, not slapping the bolt stop.

-- Chuck





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